Cam Lobes Worn

[LittleBear]

Here are a few pictures of my cam lobes on my EVO
Here you can see the top of the second lobe from the cylinders, the front intake lobe. The top looks worn uneven
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes002.jpg

Here is the closing side of the front intake lobe, the second one and the opening side of the rear intake lobe, the first one closest to the the cylinders.
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes010.jpg

Here is the top of the first lobe, the rear cylinder intake lobe.
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes006.jpg

Two questions.

1. This does not look normal to me, the exhaust lobes look fine. Is it bad?

2. What could cause this to happen on only the intake lobes?

The cam and Lifter only have 17k on them.
The lifter rollers show no wear.

[8-Ball]

arrows would be real nice here... just sayin'...

[LittleBear]

arrows would be real nice here... just sayin'...
Maybe, but anybody who can answer the question, knows what they are looking at.
I may add arrows since it would not hurt.

[8-Ball]

Maybe, but anybody who can answer the question, knows what they are looking at.
I may add arrows since it would not hurt.

Exactly my point... I look at everything you post as a learning opportunity... I don't know lobes... except mine are growin'...

[TXCHOP]

How did the lifters look? How much mileage is one this bike or cam and lifter. Looks somewhat normal to me for a higher mileage bike. All of the higher mileage evo's i have done have all look very similar to yours. It could be a combination of the beginning of a bad lifter or just cams having the hardening wearing off. To mee looks like all lobes look to have an established wear pattern.

[LittleBear]

Exactly my point... I look at everything you post as a learning opportunity... I don't know lobes... except mine are growin'...

Added arrows for you Mike. Sorry to be snippy, but when I find problems, I get testy.

[LittleBear]

How did the lifters look? How much mileage is one this bike or cam and lifter. Looks somewhat normal to me for a higher mileage bike. All of the higher mileage evo's i have done have all look very similar to yours. It could be a combination of the beginning of a bad lifter or just cams having the hardening wearing off. To mee looks like all lobes look to have an established wear pattern.

The cam and lifters have 17k on them. The rollers on the lifters look great. The exhaust lobes look great, very little wear pattern at all.

If the hardening has worn off, then IMHO, the cam is shot.

[8-Ball]

Added arrows for you Mike. Sorry to be snippy, but when I find problems, I get testy.

This is why I love ya man... thanks!

[8-Ball]

I originally thought you were talking about that weird depression I've indicated with a red arrow. Is that just the lighting?

http://www.doofclenas.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1901&stc=1&d=1178056563

[LittleBear]

Yea that is it Mike. If you look at the third lobe, there is no wear on it.

[rk custom]

is the red arrow wear or lighting?
I would put a dial indicator on those lobes and see if how worn they are. The wear looks uneven.

[LittleBear]

is the red arrow wear or lighting?
I would put a dial indicator on those lobes and see if how worn they are. The wear looks uneven.

It is wear, but I can not feel it.

[rk custom]

can you put a dial indicator on it?

[LittleBear]

can you put a dial indicator on it?

Nope, but no need, it is not worn all the way across the face of the lobe, so all I need to do is feel a difference or lay a straight edge on it and see if light shines between the edge and the center of the lobe.

I may be doing a entire top end on this beast anyway, so a new cam is what will go in.

[rk custom]

better to be safe than sorry

[HARLET]

Looks Like A Hardning Problem But, Also Looking At The Pic It May Be An Oiling Prob .the Two Lobes That Are Woren Seem To Have Less Oil On The Than The Othaea One You Can See

[LittleBear]

Well since the cam appears to be worn, and the hardening is off two lobes, I am installing a new cam. Ordered a Head Quarters H-29 cam.
Cam specs.
Intake: Open 20 close 36 lift 580 lobe center 98
Exhaust: Open 51 close 19 lift 500 lobe center 106
I have SE heads at 9.5:1 CR set up for 610 lift so the extra lift will not be an issue. I may have to machine my lifter blocks for the lift but oh well.
This cam comes with the head quarters 85 kit and can make up to 85hp and 92tq they claim with their heads. With SE heads, I figure maybe 80hp and 88tq up from 71hp and 79tq with the EV27.

Let me know what you think.

[HDMD 88]

Nope, but no need, it is not worn all the way across the face of the lobe, so all I need to do is feel a difference or lay a straight edge on it and see if light shines between the edge and the center of the lobe.

I may be doing a entire top end on this beast anyway, so a new cam is what will go in.

Bear...yes you need a new cam...looks like the lifter was jaming up into the tappet block making the lifter roller slide on the nose of the cam. With the push rods out loosen the tappet blocks and rotate the engine two full rotation...I bet the tappet bounces up when the intake cam lobe reaches peak lift.
Doc

[LittleBear]

Bear...yes you need a new cam...looks like the lifter was jaming up into the tappet block making the lifter roller slide on the nose of the cam. With the push rods out loosen the tappet blocks and rotate the engine two full rotation...I bet the tappet bounces up when the intake cam lobe reaches peak lift.
Doc
Thanks, I will look at that. With the new cam I ordered, I was going to inspect them close for clearance anyway, but I will look at the way they work with this cam before I pull it.
I do have S&S lifter blocks, and S&S said they should have clearance, but I will check it all just the same.

[dynageno]

Let us know how it works out littlebear...

[HDMD 88]

Here are a few pictures of my cam lobes on my EVO
Here you can see the top of the second lobe from the cylinders, the front intake lobe. The top looks worn uneven
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes002.jpg

Here is the closing side of the front intake lobe, the second one and the opening side of the rear intake lobe, the first one closest to the the cylinders.
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes010.jpg

Here is the top of the first lobe, the rear cylinder intake lobe.
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o198/LittleBigBear/camlobes006.jpg

Two questions.

1. This does not look normal to me, the exhaust lobes look fine. Is it bad?

2. What could cause this to happen on only the intake lobes?

The cam and Lifter only have 17k on them.
The lifter rollers show no wear.

Hey Bear....your thrust washer is in backwards...lol...I'm surprise at you...lol

[LittleBear]

Hey Bear....your thrust washer is in backwards...lol...I'm surprise at you...lol

OOOOPs well going in there anyway. LOL:roflback:

[dynageno]

How's it coming Paul???

[LittleBear]

Got the Cam, a HQ-0029
The insulation on my Timing pick up sensor was all cracked and looking nasty, so I pulled the pins from the plug, stripped off the plastic coating, there is a heat cloth under the plastic coating, and put hew heavy duty shrink tubing on it. Looks good now.
The inner cam bearing I had in my stock was bad and my Indy was also out of stock, so I had to order two new ones. This time I oiled the extra one, wrapped it up and put it away. It should not dry up and lock up like the other one did. All H-D carries here is their crappy INA bearing. I wanted the Torrington. Bearing came in Yesterday.
Measured the cam gear and it was too big for my RED pinion gear so I swapped gears from my old cam to the new cam.
I installed the new inner cam bearing and measured the end play and needed a .065 shim washer, the one in there was .060. H-D does not carry those either but my Indy had that in stock. Picked that up yesterday.
I checked the lifter block clearance and it looks like I will have to clearance the intake side of both lifter blocks. The new cam is .580 lift which translates to a 0.053 taller cam lobe. [ (.580-.495)/1.6 Note: 1.6 is the rocker arm ratio ] I will probably take .050 off each intake side of the lifter block to ensure the cam follower roller does not hit the block.
I spend the weekend with the wife since she works during the week, so I will get to it on Monday. I have all the gaskets and O-rings to put it back together and I should have all the correct parts.
I will report in when I have it back together, but it should fire Monday afternoon if all goes well.

[route66paul]

Are you doing a fresh valve job? Sometimes the valve train gets worn in to a certain lift, when you change it, you get some hesitation, or excess friction. If you have 17k on it, a basic valve job might be the prudent thing to do.

[LittleBear]

Are you doing a fresh valve job? Sometimes the valve train gets worn in to a certain lift, when you change it, you get some hesitation, or excess friction. If you have 17k on it, a basic valve job might be the prudent thing to do.

No not at this time. It had 20k on it with a Crane .581 lift cam, 17K with this .495 lift EV27 cam and now to a .580 lift on intake and .500 lift on exhaust cam. I have been running roller rocker arms and plan on a top end in 10k miles. Looking to get one more riding season out of the top end, about 50k total.
We will see how it runs and sounds after I put this cam in.

[LittleBear]

Fired on the first push of the button. Sounds quieter than it did even when the EV27 was fresh in the bike.
No parts left over that were not replaced.
Short test ride seemed to indicate it was quieter through entire RPM range.
Did not have to clearance my lifter blocks, they had .045-.055 clearance on the intake lobes.
Now I have to take her for a 50 mile test ride to verify all is well and check the carb tune but that will be tomorrow.

[Deejay]

Great News!!! You done good.... :woohoo:

[LittleBear]

Just did the tune on the bike with the new cam. Had to change the main jet from a 165 to a 170 and move the clip down 1 notch on the needle to raise it up, Also retarded the timing 2 degrees. Runs great now, no ping and pulls strong from 2k up. I like the new HQ-0029 cam.

[dynageno]

Sounds good LittleBear. The weather is getting great for riding too!