Thundermax vs twin tec with autotune ???

[GRock]

The biggest thing about the DTT is to get start and idle parameters in line. If you do that you are well on your way. The DTT comes with maps that can get you started and you can change the parameters for HP, dual runner TB, injector size, etc. Now, the bike may start but run like shitt or it may be pretty close, but the BLM will start changing the main maps and you will simply download the changes into the main fuel maps. Each time you ride, you will get much closer to optimal tune. Once you have that set up optimized, then the change of a cam or a pipe is nothing that is out of whack and the DTT will make the quick fine tunes for it the same way. Obviously, if you go from a 95 to a 117 with all different components then you will basically have to start from scratch, but you will be able to get it done. The new TCFI also has the function for auto cylinder trim offset and will get you timing adjustments too. Much more user friendly than the old stuff and much more accurate with faster readbacks.

We can get a 124 tuned for 13.5 up to 3500 for break in , with a basic map and upload the injectors size, and what you think the hp level will be in less than 30 miles. We will heat cycle the engine fist, once hot set the we go back and make sure tps and IAC is correct, if not make it right, then go for a ride. 6-8 miles come back and re load the blm, do this a few times and you will see in the data log / and blm maps how you are doing. From there you can start smoothing the tables by hand if you are having trouble in a certain area. It really goes very smooth. It beat the heck out of the other tuners in my opinion. And yes all the new fat cats do have the dual bungs

[Scabbydoo]

In the FWIW department, Morri55 has the Zippers GenI unit which is a two piece system. There is a new GenII unit that is an "all-in-one" unit with no additional modules to try and find a place to hide.

[mori55]

I switched mine over to the Gen ll and it runs great. I don't know much about the twin tec but my autotune couldn't be easier to use and setup.
It's like you get ready for this big install and hook up the laptop and run the wires and then your about done. I know i said to myself is this it ? Bike runs better than ever, i don't know about dyno #'s and don't care, that was the reason i got this unit. For the guys who want to play around with it , you can do that too.
I really don't see how my bike could run much better unless i put my 2-1 pipe back on.
Zippers auto tune also comes with canned maps to get you close or you can build your own map. They have a list of different cams , heads, exhaust,etc. If it doesnt have your make cam or heads you pick what is "close" and it will auto tune.
Zippers has a bunch of different maps so you should be able to find something close.
What I'm trying to tell you guys, this is really simple and easy to do , if you want to make it harder than it is go ahead, but it kinda defeats the purpose if your going to buy this, then go dyno crazy. Might as well keep your SERTS and ***** about not being able to find a good tuner.
The problem is most of us don't have guys like Grock or Steve to tune are bikes, what most of us have are a bunch of hacks that put a canned map in and call it good for 250.00.
Like i said my bike runs GREAT.

Guys.....

If I already have SERT, will adding the Twin Scan II+ give me everything I need as opposed to buying the whole DTT setup?

[thrasher]

Originally Posted by michael101

Guys.....

If I already have SERT, will adding the Twin Scan II+ give me everything I need as opposed to buying the whole DTT setup?

I have a PC3 on my bike right now and was wondering the same thing.

The documentation for the Twin Scan II+ on the DTT website basically infers that it does not operate in a "closed loop" system. Rather its an "open loop" system in that the Twin Scan II+ would log data as you ride and generate correction factors. These correction factors would have to be manually put into the SERT or PC3 map by the user (ie: its a manual process). Long story short, for the system to operate "closed loop", you'd need the TCFI2D. I've some more technical reading to do on the TCFI2 kit, but it appears to be just what I'm after, as I see more mods to my bike down the road.

Links for both products are below. Daytona TwinTech's websites are a bit convoluted the way they have them organized (I was reading the older one for a while). The main site is: http://www.daytona-twintec.com, and not the other one.

The instructions for the Twin Scan II are here: http://www.daytona-sensors.com/downl...structions.pdf

The tuning instructions for the TCFI2D are here: http://www.daytona-twintec.com/downl...ing_Manual.pdf

[Dirty Dan]

I stopped by an indy shop last Saturday to ask about having some motor work done and the Thunder Max was his recommendation.

I read through all 70+ pages of the sticky down the road about the Zipper's unit and all seem to rave about it. "Its the best money I've ever spent on my bike, BUT...

...it pops on decel
...I get 35 MPG
...warning codes get thrown
...idiot lights are flashing
...I have to adjust the accel thing with my laptop
...I got it wet and it quit

I'm not trying to snipe you mori55, refute our other resident experts, or say anything negative about these products. But I have no experience hopping up HDs...

...so I'm wondering - I don't seem to see such oddities associated with a SERT/dyno tune. Further, the phrase "90% tune" has been tossed about in reference to these auto-tune boxes. Even an average tuner should be able to squeeze out 90% on a dyno...so you get 90% either way.

The above said, and leaving "eliminates multiple dyno tunes" from the discussion, why not just run the SERT...or are these auto-tune boxes so good that the quirks won't bug me? Some of that stuff...no, all of that stuff, sounds annoying to me.

This is a timely thread for me...thanks to everybody for their input.

morning all... got a question for you all... installed the DTT on my 04 Road Glide and it is starting and working ... all good.. but I do not have any power to my gauges on the dash.. thinking I left a connection loose or off but they worked before the DTT was installed..... Idea's...

[jasilva]

Originally Posted by KTWillys

morning all... got a question for you all... installed the DTT on my 04 Road Glide and it is starting and working ... all good.. but I do not have any power to my gauges on the dash.. thinking I left a connection loose or off but they worked before the DTT was installed..... Idea's...

Check all of your ground wires for good contact on the frame?


Joe

Originally Posted by jasilva

Check all of your ground wires for good contact on the frame?


Joe

Yep,, a couple of times but will do so again... just to be extra sure.. I am blonde after all...
All the stuff worked fine until the change over.. hope it is something simple..
Thanks,,,

[jasilva]

One other thought KT, when I connected the WEGO on mine I blew the accessory fuse and had to up the size by a couple amps. Depending on what circuit you connected to you may have blown one.


Joe

Originally Posted by dirtydan

I stopped by an indy shop last Saturday to ask about having some motor work done and the Thunder Max was his recommendation.

I read through all 70+ pages of the sticky down the road about the Zipper's unit and all seem to rave about it. "Its the best money I've ever spent on my bike, BUT...

...it pops on decel
...I get 35 MPG
...warning codes get thrown
...idiot lights are flashing
...I have to adjust the accel thing with my laptop
...I got it wet and it quit

I'm not trying to snipe you mori55, refute our other resident experts, or say anything negative about these products. But I have no experience hopping up HDs...

...so I'm wondering - I don't seem to see such oddities associated with a SERT/dyno tune. Further, the phrase "90% tune" has been tossed about in reference to these auto-tune boxes. Even an average tuner should be able to squeeze out 90% on a dyno...so you get 90% either way.

The above said, and leaving "eliminates multiple dyno tunes" from the discussion, why not just run the SERT...or are these auto-tune boxes so good that the quirks won't bug me? Some of that stuff...no, all of that stuff, sounds annoying to me.

This is a timely thread for me...thanks to everybody for their input.

The above problems do exist, however not as frequently as it sounds. I have had the unit for a while now and yes, my MPG did take a hit, I am slowly makeing adjustments to get it back up and I am without losing anything(seat of pants dyno).

I have to say the TMAX will get you more than 90%, I have been waiting for a trip and will have the bike on a dyno to see how well it has done.

Most of the lights that everyone is talking about are not issue but a lack of reading about how the TMAX does a self check, if you will.

This thing is not perfrect, but it will tune your bike better than the average tuner at all throttle positions and if anything changes on your bike, it will accomodate the change and tune as needed. This is why most of use have the TMAX, we like to change things on the bike and we do not want to go to a dyno each time.

If you go with the SERT, you have to have the tools to see what is happing and then make the adjustment, with the TMAX it has these tools, atleast for AFR. The SERT will allow more setting to be changed, but myself, I am not versed in EFI that well to want to play with the SERT.

Originally Posted by jasilva

One other thought KT, when I connected the WEGO on mine I blew the accessory fuse and had to up the size by a couple amps. Depending on what circuit you connected to you may have blown one.


Joe

Thanks Joe,, I will check that in about an hour or so,. good one...
Kevin

[meanbean]

I just got my DTT IID / WEGO idle tuning correct on my 98 GMR build. I consider myself to be pretty good with software but it took me a couple of evenings to figure it out. I do not consider myself good at all with engine tuning and EFI. The process with the DTT works like this:
RTFM
Set it up right.
Idle it through some heat cycles and get the idle right.
Ride it, it learns and stores the data.
Download the data from the bike to your computer.
Save it in a folder.
Upload it back to the bike.
Do this repeatedly through the RPM range of your riding style.

I'm still doing break in miles on my build so I will have to put the DTT through the learning process again after it's broken in.

Things that are crucial are free air calibration of the O2 sensors and setting the throttle position sensor to .4 volts. The manual says .3 to .8 volts but the software and everybody who is in the know says .4 is the magic number. It made a big difference on my bike going from .5 to .4.

bbrownclods (down the street) is very knowledgeble and always willing to help.

I'll post up as I go through the tuning process.

Whew that was long...........

[thrasher]

Originally Posted by meanbean

I just got my DTT IID / WEGO idle tuning correct on my 98 GMR build. I consider myself to be pretty good with software but it took me a couple of evenings to figure it out. I do not consider myself good at all with engine tuning and EFI. The process with the DTT works like this:
RTFM
Set it up right.
Idle it through some heat cycles and get the idle right.
Ride it, it learns and stores the data.
Download the data from the bike to your computer.
Save it in a folder.
Upload it back to the bike.
Do this repeatedly through the RPM range of your riding style.

I'm still doing break in miles on my build so I will have to put the DTT through the learning process again after it's broken in.

Things that are crucial are free air calibration of the O2 sensors and setting the throttle position sensor to .4 volts. The manual says .3 to .8 volts but the software and everybody who is in the know says .4 is the magic number. It made a big difference on my bike going from .5 to .4.

bbrownclods (down the street) is very knowledgeble and always willing to help.

I'll post up as I go through the tuning process.

Whew that was long...........

Thanks for the detailed post. I'll be headed in the same direction as you soon enough, so this is all very helpful.